justalex1971
New member
I couldn't decide on a fancy title for this post, so here's what I settled on. After spending over 8 months digging deep into software developer salaries, I've got some eye-opening stuff to share.
Ever wondered how foreigners and online platforms take advantage of small American businesses with foreign labor? I'm talking about things like why Upwork insists on hourly payments for freelancers, or what the real cost of living is in other countries, or even how much experienced software and web developers actually make abroad. And guess what? You, yes you, as an American entrepreneur, are getting the short end of the stick.
Here's a shocker: In third world countries like India, Pakistan, China, Ukraine, Venezuela, Brazil, etc., workers don't get paid by the hour. So why the heck is there this culture of hourly wages for software developers online?
Before I dive into that, let's set the scene. Most freelancers are from places where the cost of living is dirt cheap compared to the U.S. And guess how Americans are seen? Rich, spoiled, and totally clueless about the world around them. Ouch, but kinda true.
Now, brace yourself: The hourly rates on platforms like Upwork are massively inflated. Sure, $20/hr might seem like a steal to you, but in reality, you're getting ripped off. That $20/hr? That's more than what many Americans earn for the same gig in small towns across our own country.
Let's do some math: $20 x 40 hours = $800 a week. That's $3200 a month after taxes – which is what developers in many small American towns make, even today!
So, why on earth are you shelling out big bucks to foreigners who are less skilled and live in places where the cost of living is a fraction of what it is in the U.S.? You're basically hiring a subpar "freelance" developer who couldn't care less about your project, works whenever they feel like it, and charges you 3x-4x more than what Google pays their engineers in India. Yep, that's a fact!
Now, let's talk about what's really going down here. Most of the workers on platforms like Upwork and Freelancer? They're not exactly top-notch designers or developers. They're the rejects, the ones who couldn't land a job with local or international tech companies.
And then there are these so-called "agencies" run by code-pimps – non-technical businessmen posing as project managers. They hire non-English speaking developers for peanuts, exploiting them to no end. You'll find heaps of them on Upwork, mostly from places like India, Pakistan, South America, and Ukraine.
Oh, and in case you're wondering, my salary and cost of living data are spot on. I've spoken to tons of reputable recruiters and companies across India, Pakistan, Venezuela, Brazil, Chile, China, and Ukraine.
Don't bother with those salary sites on the internet – most of that data is crowdsourced, and you know what happens then? The numbers get pumped up by these offshore coders themselves.
Here's the thing: As Americans, everything we do is in English and out there on the internet for all to see. But when it comes to foreign lands, we're clueless. Their local sites are in languages we don't understand, so we're totally in the dark about actual wages.
Critics might say I'm talking like a privileged American, but that's far from the truth. I'm a foreigner myself who loves to travel and believes in paying people what they're worth, so they can live well – based on their local wages.
This post might ruffle some feathers on a far-left website like Reddit, but every word of it is fact. Freelancer sites like Upwork have created a culture of inflated hourly rates to line their own pockets. But who gets screwed over? You – the American small business owner, the entrepreneur.
You'll be taken for a ride by workers in India, Pakistan, China, Ukraine, or any South American country. Period.
I've painstakingly compiled a list of ACTUAL developer salaries from various countries. Sure, there'll be naysayers and folks who claim my numbers are off, but guess what? They're ABSOLUTELY 100% ACCURATE.
Some might throw around words like "slavery," "racism," "taking advantage of poor people," or "being cheap." But those words mean diddly squat when faced with the facts.
Running a business is all about being smart and frugal, and being aware of what's happening around you. And let me tell you, the cost of living in these countries is dirt cheap. Anyone arguing with my data has some ulterior motive.
So, without further ado, here are the ACTUAL developer salaries and cost of living data from various major cities around the world. It took me months to gather, analyze, and verify this info. And just a heads up: most foreigners looking for work on these platforms fall into the Junior category.
*Cost of decent lunch is when eating out. Cooking at home is a lot cheaper for everyone.
San Francisco, CA:
- Cost of decent lunch: $25.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $3600.00
- Beginner: $7000 per month ($43.75/hr)
- Mid-range: $10,000 per month ($62.50/hr)
- Senior: $15,000 or more per month (assuming minimum $15,000) ($93.75/hr)
Karachi, Pakistan:
- Cost of decent lunch: $2.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $200.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $300 per month ($0.47/hr)
- Senior: $900 per month ($1.41/hr)
Surat, India:
- Cost of decent lunch: $3.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $250.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $500 per month ($0.78/hr)
- Senior: $1100 per month ($1.72/hr)
Dhaka, Bangladesh:
- Cost of decent lunch: $2.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $150.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $350 per month ($0.55/hr)
- Senior: $700 per month ($1.09/hr)
Kiev, Ukraine:
- Cost of decent lunch: $5.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $300.00
- Beginner: $300 per month ($0.47/hr)
- Mid-range: $500 per month ($0.78/hr)
- Senior: $700 per month ($1.09/hr)
Any Major City, Chile:
- Cost of decent lunch: $5.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $235.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $600 per month ($0.94/hr)
- Senior: $1100 per month ($1.72/hr)
Guangzhou, China:
- Cost of decent lunch: $6.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $300.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39)
- Mid-range: $500 per month ($0.78/hr)
- Senior: $800 per month ($1.25/hr)
Caracas, Venezuela:
- Cost of decent lunch: $2.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $200.00
- Beginner: $150 per month ($0.23/hr)
- Mid-range: $400 per month ($0.63/hr)
- Senior: $700 per month ($1.09/hr)
Now, we Americans might struggle to wrap our heads around salaries below ten bucks an hour. But guess what? That's the reality for most of the world outside of North America and Western Europe.
Don't get it twisted though – the salaries I listed ain't pocket change. They're enough to live decently in these parts of the world.
So, next time you're scouting a programmer, coder, or developer for your project, whether it's on Upwork or some other platform from a third-world country, just remember – these folks think you're clueless about local wages.
Share your experiences where you felt like you've been taken for a ride by some offshore worker? Did you overpay? Was the task actually finished how you wanted?
Share your experiences and let's kick off a discussion.
Ever wondered how foreigners and online platforms take advantage of small American businesses with foreign labor? I'm talking about things like why Upwork insists on hourly payments for freelancers, or what the real cost of living is in other countries, or even how much experienced software and web developers actually make abroad. And guess what? You, yes you, as an American entrepreneur, are getting the short end of the stick.
Here's a shocker: In third world countries like India, Pakistan, China, Ukraine, Venezuela, Brazil, etc., workers don't get paid by the hour. So why the heck is there this culture of hourly wages for software developers online?
Before I dive into that, let's set the scene. Most freelancers are from places where the cost of living is dirt cheap compared to the U.S. And guess how Americans are seen? Rich, spoiled, and totally clueless about the world around them. Ouch, but kinda true.
Now, brace yourself: The hourly rates on platforms like Upwork are massively inflated. Sure, $20/hr might seem like a steal to you, but in reality, you're getting ripped off. That $20/hr? That's more than what many Americans earn for the same gig in small towns across our own country.
Let's do some math: $20 x 40 hours = $800 a week. That's $3200 a month after taxes – which is what developers in many small American towns make, even today!
So, why on earth are you shelling out big bucks to foreigners who are less skilled and live in places where the cost of living is a fraction of what it is in the U.S.? You're basically hiring a subpar "freelance" developer who couldn't care less about your project, works whenever they feel like it, and charges you 3x-4x more than what Google pays their engineers in India. Yep, that's a fact!
Now, let's talk about what's really going down here. Most of the workers on platforms like Upwork and Freelancer? They're not exactly top-notch designers or developers. They're the rejects, the ones who couldn't land a job with local or international tech companies.
And then there are these so-called "agencies" run by code-pimps – non-technical businessmen posing as project managers. They hire non-English speaking developers for peanuts, exploiting them to no end. You'll find heaps of them on Upwork, mostly from places like India, Pakistan, South America, and Ukraine.
Oh, and in case you're wondering, my salary and cost of living data are spot on. I've spoken to tons of reputable recruiters and companies across India, Pakistan, Venezuela, Brazil, Chile, China, and Ukraine.
Don't bother with those salary sites on the internet – most of that data is crowdsourced, and you know what happens then? The numbers get pumped up by these offshore coders themselves.
Here's the thing: As Americans, everything we do is in English and out there on the internet for all to see. But when it comes to foreign lands, we're clueless. Their local sites are in languages we don't understand, so we're totally in the dark about actual wages.
Critics might say I'm talking like a privileged American, but that's far from the truth. I'm a foreigner myself who loves to travel and believes in paying people what they're worth, so they can live well – based on their local wages.
This post might ruffle some feathers on a far-left website like Reddit, but every word of it is fact. Freelancer sites like Upwork have created a culture of inflated hourly rates to line their own pockets. But who gets screwed over? You – the American small business owner, the entrepreneur.
You'll be taken for a ride by workers in India, Pakistan, China, Ukraine, or any South American country. Period.
I've painstakingly compiled a list of ACTUAL developer salaries from various countries. Sure, there'll be naysayers and folks who claim my numbers are off, but guess what? They're ABSOLUTELY 100% ACCURATE.
Some might throw around words like "slavery," "racism," "taking advantage of poor people," or "being cheap." But those words mean diddly squat when faced with the facts.
Running a business is all about being smart and frugal, and being aware of what's happening around you. And let me tell you, the cost of living in these countries is dirt cheap. Anyone arguing with my data has some ulterior motive.
So, without further ado, here are the ACTUAL developer salaries and cost of living data from various major cities around the world. It took me months to gather, analyze, and verify this info. And just a heads up: most foreigners looking for work on these platforms fall into the Junior category.
*Cost of decent lunch is when eating out. Cooking at home is a lot cheaper for everyone.
San Francisco, CA:
- Cost of decent lunch: $25.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $3600.00
- Beginner: $7000 per month ($43.75/hr)
- Mid-range: $10,000 per month ($62.50/hr)
- Senior: $15,000 or more per month (assuming minimum $15,000) ($93.75/hr)
Karachi, Pakistan:
- Cost of decent lunch: $2.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $200.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $300 per month ($0.47/hr)
- Senior: $900 per month ($1.41/hr)
Surat, India:
- Cost of decent lunch: $3.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $250.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $500 per month ($0.78/hr)
- Senior: $1100 per month ($1.72/hr)
Dhaka, Bangladesh:
- Cost of decent lunch: $2.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $150.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $350 per month ($0.55/hr)
- Senior: $700 per month ($1.09/hr)
Kiev, Ukraine:
- Cost of decent lunch: $5.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $300.00
- Beginner: $300 per month ($0.47/hr)
- Mid-range: $500 per month ($0.78/hr)
- Senior: $700 per month ($1.09/hr)
Any Major City, Chile:
- Cost of decent lunch: $5.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $235.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39/hr)
- Mid-range: $600 per month ($0.94/hr)
- Senior: $1100 per month ($1.72/hr)
Guangzhou, China:
- Cost of decent lunch: $6.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $300.00
- Beginner: $250 per month ($0.39)
- Mid-range: $500 per month ($0.78/hr)
- Senior: $800 per month ($1.25/hr)
Caracas, Venezuela:
- Cost of decent lunch: $2.00
- Rent for 2 bedrooms in a decent neighborhood: $200.00
- Beginner: $150 per month ($0.23/hr)
- Mid-range: $400 per month ($0.63/hr)
- Senior: $700 per month ($1.09/hr)
Now, we Americans might struggle to wrap our heads around salaries below ten bucks an hour. But guess what? That's the reality for most of the world outside of North America and Western Europe.
Don't get it twisted though – the salaries I listed ain't pocket change. They're enough to live decently in these parts of the world.
So, next time you're scouting a programmer, coder, or developer for your project, whether it's on Upwork or some other platform from a third-world country, just remember – these folks think you're clueless about local wages.
Share your experiences where you felt like you've been taken for a ride by some offshore worker? Did you overpay? Was the task actually finished how you wanted?
Share your experiences and let's kick off a discussion.